Defining the Extra Deck

[ragda]

I want to start up a discussion on how one basically chooses the cards for their extra deck. Of course, the different archetypes out there are more suited for particular types of summons, and not many are adept at summoning all 3 different types of extra deck monsters. This is more for discussing the generic inclusions, as well as any archetype's Extra Decks you'd like to discuss (IF you guys think this can work better here maybe rather than in that deck's specific discussion thread), such as what you think are auto-ins. Talk about ratios, talk about matchups that certain cards are better for, etc., let's just consider the portion of gameplay that forces you to consider the 15 you will want to have handy before the game even starts. Sometimes that also means cutting potential choices but this is where we can weigh the choices and consider the pros and cons of each card!

We will have different sections for generic and generally considered decent Xyz and Synchro Monsters and comparing them to other cards that fill similar roles, ranks or levels. Then another section that details possible Extra Decks for particular archetypes, considering both their synergy for the deck's uses and their standalone vs situational value. I will post comments made for each individual cards into the OP, as well as any comparison made between cards of the same level/rank. Suggest cards that should be considered for each level if I didn't list them. You guys can also discuss the rankings of each card in their specific Level/Rank sections in terms of what is more decent than others in the same section, what you'd use sooner than others, etc.

We'll start with Xyz Monsters, and I'll add more as we get this rolling along. 

Xyz Monsters:
Rank 1:
2x1
Slacker Magician
Number 39: Utopia Roots
Ghostrick Dullahan
Number 63: Shamoji Soldier

3x1
(Do you guys wanna talk about these?)

Rank 2
2x2
Gachi Gachi Gantetsu
Herald of Pure Light
Armored Kappa
Daigusto Phoenix
Shining Elf

3x2
(see 3x1)

Rank 3
2x3
Wind-Up Zenmaines
Number 49: Fortune Tune
Number 30: Acid Golem of Destruction
Chronomaly Crystal Chrononaut
Leviair the Sea Dragon
Mechquipped Angineer
Number 17: Leviathan
M-X-Saber Invoker
Battlin' Boxer Cheat Commissioner
Melomelody the Brass Djinn
Muzurhythm the String Djinn
Temtempo the Percussion Djinn
Number 47: Nightmare Shark
Number 20: Giga-Brilliant
Submersible Carrier Aero Shark
Ghostrick Alucard

3x3
(see 3x1)

Rank 4
2x4
Maestroke the Symphony Djinn
Number 85: Crazy Box
Gem-Knight Pearl
Number 39: Utopia
Wind-Up Zenmaister
Gagaga Cowboy
Abyss Dweller
Diamond Dire Wolf
Lavalval Chain
Diagusto Emeral
Number 50: Blackship of Corn
Photon Papilloperative
Evigishki Merrowgeist
Number 101: Silent Honor ARK
Evilswarm Exciton Knight
Steelswarm Roach
King of Feral Imps
Number 106: Giant Hand (good luck owning this)
Number 44: Sky Pegasus
Zubaba General
Princess Cologne
Queen Dragun Djinn
Kachi Kochi Dragon

3x4
(see 3x1)

More to come...

P.S. Do you think we should consider Xyz Monsters and Synchro Monsters in separate threads? That way it feels a bit more focused already. Or do you think it's better to contain it altogether?

[Ursiel]

I'm good just doing all extra deck monsters in the 1 thread but that is just me. I consider both Synchro and Xyz usually before building a main deck though.

I do have auto includes for different ranks and levels dependent on what is possible.

Rank 1 is Dullahan or Slacker Magician, this difference is chosen on whether or not I need defense or aggression. But like the next one, not likely for me to actually ever use.

Rank 2 I generally don't ever use, but Gachi is my default since I don't own Daigusto Phoenix.

Rank 3 usually gets at least 2 spots if I can make them. Leviair is the first one if there is any expected way to banish monsters. #49 is a staple for me as far as Rank 3 goes, and if Leviair didn't make the cut Angineer goes in.

Rank 4 another one that is at least 2. As of right now it is #101 and Exciton Knight, prior to them it was Diamond Dire and usually 1 that was specifically beneficial to the deck. Lavalval Chain and #66 were common choices for the decks I built.

I'll get in on Synchros later.

[Drillwarrior]

Okay, this is really cool!
I think this should be Synchro and Xyz (And, also, for the very rare deck. Fusions)
It feels this thread should be for all extra deck stuff roughly and if people need help figuring their extra for a specific deck then this sounds like a good place for it.
I honestly don't know what I go with as I haven't really built much in detail lately. But Silent Honor ARK and Exciton are definitely staples for Rank 4.

[Ursiel]

Also I feel that if the deck is using a lot of the R1-3 you need at least 1, maybe 2, Downerd Magician in the extra. That card is just amaz-balls in those type of weenie decks.

[ragda]

Agreed, it's rather staple-y in that sense. In the same manner, Gaia Knight the Thunder Charger for those Rank 5-6 decks, like Hazy Flame, Constellars, certain Monarch builds, Steelswarms, Rank 5 spam, etc.

As for fusions, those are kind of a bit more straightforward. Most Fusions that are used these days aren't summoned by way of the traditional method. Often, it's via Instant Fusion that we see any such Extra Deck cards. They typically are 2-3 slots to cover the amount of copies of IF is in the deck, as well as flexibility in terms of the needed level, type and/or attribute.

I'll throw that in as another section eventually. It certainly does merit discussion, as it impacts the deck you choose them for, even if most decks that use Instant Fusion basically already have the 1-2 Fusions they'll ever need.

Side Note: Just in case people have wondered why Thousand-Eyes Restrict is still banned even though the easy way to summon it, Metamorphosis, is still banned as well... well, that's because Instant Fusion is ALSO a thing. Could you imagine how cheap it would be to drop a Spell and 1000 LP and you have a fearsome monster. It may not last long, but it'll certainly come out taking at least a monster down with it.

Also, that would make Piper Chaos a very powerful threat, and a more relevant Instant Fusion summon for Sophia variants.

[Ursiel]

Piper Chaos with access to TER would be so damned wrong.

[JerkJerk]

Feb 14, 2014 18:22:51 GMT -6 Ursiel said:

Also I feel that if the deck is using a lot of the R1-3 you need at least 1, maybe 2, Downerd Magician in the extra. That card is just amaz-balls in those type of weenie decks.

Did you just quote a Miley Cyrus film?

Did you? Did you just ... ?

I like the idea behind this thread, and I do agree the extra deck has now become as much a staple pattern than previously. Especially considering as XYZ' keep coming, Synchros and Fusions become rarities and more circumstantial. Makes me wonder if the 15 card limit ever increases, or if the Side Deck follows suit.

[ragda]

I think retaining the 15 card count means that decisions made in deckbuilding will have great repercussions, and thus be more reflective of the player's skills rather than just jamming more than "needed". Of course, what's needed is based on a lot of factors, but at any rate, that shows how the player decides to prioritize the deck's needs from "wants".

I will update this a bit more eventually, just been pretty occupied with something else.

[JerkJerk]

Feb 19, 2014 5:40:19 GMT -6 ragda said:

I think retaining the 15 card count means that decisions made in deckbuilding will have great repercussions, and thus be more reflective of the player's skills rather than just jamming more than "needed". Of course, what's needed is based on a lot of factors, but at any rate, that shows how the player decides to prioritize the deck's needs from "wants".

I will update this a bit more eventually, just been pretty occupied with something else.

To play Devil's advocate here, eventually there just won't be space to optimize period. What if we get yet another Extra Deck type? How long will it be until you're running wonky ratios until its an utter crapshoot to have the extra deck.

After awhile, skill only takes you so far when working with a confined card count.

[ragda]

As of the moment, Pendulum Summons do not take up any Extra Deck slots at the beginning of the game, so it will take the next generation to spur any kind of changes to its size.

As well too, if you really need to play that much Extra Deck, maybe you gotta go back and refocus your Main Deck. Sure, some decks can play all three Extra Deck cards atm, but they pick the most viable of the lesser types because they learn to prioritize some plays over others. Wish you had X Synchro at this time? Well, you rarely Synchro anyways with just Veiler, so you weren't expecting the rare Level 9 with Veiler and 2 Level 4s. You're better off keeping Veiler in hand and maybe making a Rank 4.

You also need to consider the copies of particular cards in the Extra. Do you feel like Y card is a central card and that you'll want to summon often? You'll sacrifice slots and flexibility to have that option. Flipside is if you want more options, but then sacrifice the redundancy of plays. Infernities, for example COULD run 1 Lavalval Chain in Xyz-centric builds. However, despite the extra card for options, weigh it out if the "weakest" option is worth losing Lavalval Chain for.

[Ursiel]

JerkJerk I really have no idea if I quoted a Miley Cyrus anything. I know I've heard amaze-balls before but it was in a conversation. I can't even think of anything she has been in that wasn't Hannah Montana shit that would have been all over Disney when my oldest was 2-3.

Xyz centered Infernity decks actually have a few things that they could cut concerning redundancy for options. Leviair is another option I have never needed more than 1 of. Lavalval Chain I've used 2, but 3 has rarely been a worthwhile option for me.